How do I properly set up this integral equation?
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Using the gaussian law I want to determine the field strength of a charged stick on another load.
The base formula for that is
$$epsilon_0 oint {vec{E} cdot d vec{A}} = q$$
A second formula for q is:
$$ q = lambda cdot h $$
$$vec{E} = frac{1}{4cdot pi cdot epsilon_0} cdot frac{q_1}{r^2} cdot hat{r}$$
In this case we use a cylinder to solve our problem and we only need the lateral surface.
$$A = 2cdot pi cdot d cdot h$$
My questions
I have a strong problem with a surface written as vector.
Assuming we have a situation like in the first picture of this question where the lateral surface of our cylinder touches the load.
How would I properly write the surface as vector (how can I determine the direction vector)?
Usually my approach would be $vec{r} = (x_2 - x_1)hat{x} + (y_2 - y_1)hat{y}$. But as we have a solid here I have problems finding the start and end coordinates.Until now I only solved integrals in the form of $int f(x) dx$ but now I have an equation like the one above. What would be my "x" here? How would I solve this integral?
As you can imagine this is a task from my electronics class. It's not a homework but it was an example.
Unfortunately we did explicitly not pay attention to the integral and we did not pay attention to the surface written as vector.
What we did is the following:
$$epsilon_0 oint {vec{E} cdot d vec{A}} = q$$
$$epsilon_0 cdot |vec{E}| cdot 2 cdot pi cdot h cdot d = q$$
Because $lambda$ is given in this particular task we can do
$$epsilon_0 cdot |vec{E}| cdot 2 cdot pi cdot h cdot d = lambda cdot h$$
$$|vec{E}| = frac{lambda}{2cdot pi cdot d cdot epsilon_0}$$
vector-analysis physics
add a comment |
up vote
0
down vote
favorite
Using the gaussian law I want to determine the field strength of a charged stick on another load.
The base formula for that is
$$epsilon_0 oint {vec{E} cdot d vec{A}} = q$$
A second formula for q is:
$$ q = lambda cdot h $$
$$vec{E} = frac{1}{4cdot pi cdot epsilon_0} cdot frac{q_1}{r^2} cdot hat{r}$$
In this case we use a cylinder to solve our problem and we only need the lateral surface.
$$A = 2cdot pi cdot d cdot h$$
My questions
I have a strong problem with a surface written as vector.
Assuming we have a situation like in the first picture of this question where the lateral surface of our cylinder touches the load.
How would I properly write the surface as vector (how can I determine the direction vector)?
Usually my approach would be $vec{r} = (x_2 - x_1)hat{x} + (y_2 - y_1)hat{y}$. But as we have a solid here I have problems finding the start and end coordinates.Until now I only solved integrals in the form of $int f(x) dx$ but now I have an equation like the one above. What would be my "x" here? How would I solve this integral?
As you can imagine this is a task from my electronics class. It's not a homework but it was an example.
Unfortunately we did explicitly not pay attention to the integral and we did not pay attention to the surface written as vector.
What we did is the following:
$$epsilon_0 oint {vec{E} cdot d vec{A}} = q$$
$$epsilon_0 cdot |vec{E}| cdot 2 cdot pi cdot h cdot d = q$$
Because $lambda$ is given in this particular task we can do
$$epsilon_0 cdot |vec{E}| cdot 2 cdot pi cdot h cdot d = lambda cdot h$$
$$|vec{E}| = frac{lambda}{2cdot pi cdot d cdot epsilon_0}$$
vector-analysis physics
add a comment |
up vote
0
down vote
favorite
up vote
0
down vote
favorite
Using the gaussian law I want to determine the field strength of a charged stick on another load.
The base formula for that is
$$epsilon_0 oint {vec{E} cdot d vec{A}} = q$$
A second formula for q is:
$$ q = lambda cdot h $$
$$vec{E} = frac{1}{4cdot pi cdot epsilon_0} cdot frac{q_1}{r^2} cdot hat{r}$$
In this case we use a cylinder to solve our problem and we only need the lateral surface.
$$A = 2cdot pi cdot d cdot h$$
My questions
I have a strong problem with a surface written as vector.
Assuming we have a situation like in the first picture of this question where the lateral surface of our cylinder touches the load.
How would I properly write the surface as vector (how can I determine the direction vector)?
Usually my approach would be $vec{r} = (x_2 - x_1)hat{x} + (y_2 - y_1)hat{y}$. But as we have a solid here I have problems finding the start and end coordinates.Until now I only solved integrals in the form of $int f(x) dx$ but now I have an equation like the one above. What would be my "x" here? How would I solve this integral?
As you can imagine this is a task from my electronics class. It's not a homework but it was an example.
Unfortunately we did explicitly not pay attention to the integral and we did not pay attention to the surface written as vector.
What we did is the following:
$$epsilon_0 oint {vec{E} cdot d vec{A}} = q$$
$$epsilon_0 cdot |vec{E}| cdot 2 cdot pi cdot h cdot d = q$$
Because $lambda$ is given in this particular task we can do
$$epsilon_0 cdot |vec{E}| cdot 2 cdot pi cdot h cdot d = lambda cdot h$$
$$|vec{E}| = frac{lambda}{2cdot pi cdot d cdot epsilon_0}$$
vector-analysis physics
Using the gaussian law I want to determine the field strength of a charged stick on another load.
The base formula for that is
$$epsilon_0 oint {vec{E} cdot d vec{A}} = q$$
A second formula for q is:
$$ q = lambda cdot h $$
$$vec{E} = frac{1}{4cdot pi cdot epsilon_0} cdot frac{q_1}{r^2} cdot hat{r}$$
In this case we use a cylinder to solve our problem and we only need the lateral surface.
$$A = 2cdot pi cdot d cdot h$$
My questions
I have a strong problem with a surface written as vector.
Assuming we have a situation like in the first picture of this question where the lateral surface of our cylinder touches the load.
How would I properly write the surface as vector (how can I determine the direction vector)?
Usually my approach would be $vec{r} = (x_2 - x_1)hat{x} + (y_2 - y_1)hat{y}$. But as we have a solid here I have problems finding the start and end coordinates.Until now I only solved integrals in the form of $int f(x) dx$ but now I have an equation like the one above. What would be my "x" here? How would I solve this integral?
As you can imagine this is a task from my electronics class. It's not a homework but it was an example.
Unfortunately we did explicitly not pay attention to the integral and we did not pay attention to the surface written as vector.
What we did is the following:
$$epsilon_0 oint {vec{E} cdot d vec{A}} = q$$
$$epsilon_0 cdot |vec{E}| cdot 2 cdot pi cdot h cdot d = q$$
Because $lambda$ is given in this particular task we can do
$$epsilon_0 cdot |vec{E}| cdot 2 cdot pi cdot h cdot d = lambda cdot h$$
$$|vec{E}| = frac{lambda}{2cdot pi cdot d cdot epsilon_0}$$
vector-analysis physics
vector-analysis physics
asked Nov 17 at 1:53
TimSch
1007
1007
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1 Answer
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Due to symmetry considerations, $vec E$ at a given point is always pointing along the line from that point that is perpendicular to the wire. We can use cylindrical coordinates. With $d$ the distance from the wire, we can write $vec E=E(d)hat r$. For a surface, the vector $dvec A$ is always perpendicular to that surface. So in cylindrical coordinates we can write the surface element that is part of the cylinder with radius $r$ as $dvec A=r dtheta dh hat r$. Notice that $dvec A$ and $vec E$ are parallel (or antiparallel), so $$vec Ecdot dvec A=EdA=E d dtheta dh$$
Integrating $theta$ from $0$ to $2pi$ and $h$ from $0$ to $h$, you get your formula. In conclusion, you get the answer due to the fact that $vec E$ is always perpendicular to the surface of the cylinder of radius $d$, and is only dependent on the magnitude of $d$.
Thanks again! I have still one question: How can I find the antiderivative of this? As I mentioned, unfortunately we skipped this part. I know that this is probably absolutely simple but it confuses me anyway. Secondly another probably quite silly question: How would the unit vectors look like?
– TimSch
Nov 17 at 23:37
1
Integral over $dtheta$ is $2pi$, integral over $dh$ is the length of the wire $L$ (will go to infinity, but will cancel with the charge: $q=lambda L$)
– Andrei
Nov 17 at 23:59
add a comment |
1 Answer
1
active
oldest
votes
1 Answer
1
active
oldest
votes
active
oldest
votes
active
oldest
votes
up vote
1
down vote
accepted
Due to symmetry considerations, $vec E$ at a given point is always pointing along the line from that point that is perpendicular to the wire. We can use cylindrical coordinates. With $d$ the distance from the wire, we can write $vec E=E(d)hat r$. For a surface, the vector $dvec A$ is always perpendicular to that surface. So in cylindrical coordinates we can write the surface element that is part of the cylinder with radius $r$ as $dvec A=r dtheta dh hat r$. Notice that $dvec A$ and $vec E$ are parallel (or antiparallel), so $$vec Ecdot dvec A=EdA=E d dtheta dh$$
Integrating $theta$ from $0$ to $2pi$ and $h$ from $0$ to $h$, you get your formula. In conclusion, you get the answer due to the fact that $vec E$ is always perpendicular to the surface of the cylinder of radius $d$, and is only dependent on the magnitude of $d$.
Thanks again! I have still one question: How can I find the antiderivative of this? As I mentioned, unfortunately we skipped this part. I know that this is probably absolutely simple but it confuses me anyway. Secondly another probably quite silly question: How would the unit vectors look like?
– TimSch
Nov 17 at 23:37
1
Integral over $dtheta$ is $2pi$, integral over $dh$ is the length of the wire $L$ (will go to infinity, but will cancel with the charge: $q=lambda L$)
– Andrei
Nov 17 at 23:59
add a comment |
up vote
1
down vote
accepted
Due to symmetry considerations, $vec E$ at a given point is always pointing along the line from that point that is perpendicular to the wire. We can use cylindrical coordinates. With $d$ the distance from the wire, we can write $vec E=E(d)hat r$. For a surface, the vector $dvec A$ is always perpendicular to that surface. So in cylindrical coordinates we can write the surface element that is part of the cylinder with radius $r$ as $dvec A=r dtheta dh hat r$. Notice that $dvec A$ and $vec E$ are parallel (or antiparallel), so $$vec Ecdot dvec A=EdA=E d dtheta dh$$
Integrating $theta$ from $0$ to $2pi$ and $h$ from $0$ to $h$, you get your formula. In conclusion, you get the answer due to the fact that $vec E$ is always perpendicular to the surface of the cylinder of radius $d$, and is only dependent on the magnitude of $d$.
Thanks again! I have still one question: How can I find the antiderivative of this? As I mentioned, unfortunately we skipped this part. I know that this is probably absolutely simple but it confuses me anyway. Secondly another probably quite silly question: How would the unit vectors look like?
– TimSch
Nov 17 at 23:37
1
Integral over $dtheta$ is $2pi$, integral over $dh$ is the length of the wire $L$ (will go to infinity, but will cancel with the charge: $q=lambda L$)
– Andrei
Nov 17 at 23:59
add a comment |
up vote
1
down vote
accepted
up vote
1
down vote
accepted
Due to symmetry considerations, $vec E$ at a given point is always pointing along the line from that point that is perpendicular to the wire. We can use cylindrical coordinates. With $d$ the distance from the wire, we can write $vec E=E(d)hat r$. For a surface, the vector $dvec A$ is always perpendicular to that surface. So in cylindrical coordinates we can write the surface element that is part of the cylinder with radius $r$ as $dvec A=r dtheta dh hat r$. Notice that $dvec A$ and $vec E$ are parallel (or antiparallel), so $$vec Ecdot dvec A=EdA=E d dtheta dh$$
Integrating $theta$ from $0$ to $2pi$ and $h$ from $0$ to $h$, you get your formula. In conclusion, you get the answer due to the fact that $vec E$ is always perpendicular to the surface of the cylinder of radius $d$, and is only dependent on the magnitude of $d$.
Due to symmetry considerations, $vec E$ at a given point is always pointing along the line from that point that is perpendicular to the wire. We can use cylindrical coordinates. With $d$ the distance from the wire, we can write $vec E=E(d)hat r$. For a surface, the vector $dvec A$ is always perpendicular to that surface. So in cylindrical coordinates we can write the surface element that is part of the cylinder with radius $r$ as $dvec A=r dtheta dh hat r$. Notice that $dvec A$ and $vec E$ are parallel (or antiparallel), so $$vec Ecdot dvec A=EdA=E d dtheta dh$$
Integrating $theta$ from $0$ to $2pi$ and $h$ from $0$ to $h$, you get your formula. In conclusion, you get the answer due to the fact that $vec E$ is always perpendicular to the surface of the cylinder of radius $d$, and is only dependent on the magnitude of $d$.
answered Nov 17 at 3:58
Andrei
10.3k21025
10.3k21025
Thanks again! I have still one question: How can I find the antiderivative of this? As I mentioned, unfortunately we skipped this part. I know that this is probably absolutely simple but it confuses me anyway. Secondly another probably quite silly question: How would the unit vectors look like?
– TimSch
Nov 17 at 23:37
1
Integral over $dtheta$ is $2pi$, integral over $dh$ is the length of the wire $L$ (will go to infinity, but will cancel with the charge: $q=lambda L$)
– Andrei
Nov 17 at 23:59
add a comment |
Thanks again! I have still one question: How can I find the antiderivative of this? As I mentioned, unfortunately we skipped this part. I know that this is probably absolutely simple but it confuses me anyway. Secondly another probably quite silly question: How would the unit vectors look like?
– TimSch
Nov 17 at 23:37
1
Integral over $dtheta$ is $2pi$, integral over $dh$ is the length of the wire $L$ (will go to infinity, but will cancel with the charge: $q=lambda L$)
– Andrei
Nov 17 at 23:59
Thanks again! I have still one question: How can I find the antiderivative of this? As I mentioned, unfortunately we skipped this part. I know that this is probably absolutely simple but it confuses me anyway. Secondly another probably quite silly question: How would the unit vectors look like?
– TimSch
Nov 17 at 23:37
Thanks again! I have still one question: How can I find the antiderivative of this? As I mentioned, unfortunately we skipped this part. I know that this is probably absolutely simple but it confuses me anyway. Secondly another probably quite silly question: How would the unit vectors look like?
– TimSch
Nov 17 at 23:37
1
1
Integral over $dtheta$ is $2pi$, integral over $dh$ is the length of the wire $L$ (will go to infinity, but will cancel with the charge: $q=lambda L$)
– Andrei
Nov 17 at 23:59
Integral over $dtheta$ is $2pi$, integral over $dh$ is the length of the wire $L$ (will go to infinity, but will cancel with the charge: $q=lambda L$)
– Andrei
Nov 17 at 23:59
add a comment |
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