equality of two simple tensors in $R=k[x,y]$
$begingroup$
Consider $R=k[x,y]$, where $k$ is a field. Consider the $R$-module $M=langle x,yrangle$.
I would like to see that $x otimes y neq y otimes x$ in $M otimes_R M$.
My try to prove it:
Let $F$ be the free abelian group with basis $M times M$; that is, $F$ is free on all ordered pairs $(a,b)$ with $a,b in M$. Define $S$ to be the subgroup of $F$ generated by all elements of the following types:
- $(a,b+b')-(a,b)-(a,b')$
- $(a+a',b)-(a,b)-(a',b)$
- $(ar,b)-(a,rb)$
Since $M otimes_R M = F/S$, $x otimes y = y otimes x$ would imply that $(x,y)-(y,x)$ lies in $S$. This would imply that $(x,y)-(y,x)$ has one of the forms mentioned above.
Let's say
$$(x,y)-(y,x) = (ar,b)-(a,rb)$$ for some $a,b in M$ and some $r in R$.
Consider $M=langle x,y rangle = {cx+dy hspace{0,2cm}| c,d in k[x,y]}$.
The equality above would imply $ar=x$ and for that we would need $r=1$ and $a=x$ since $ain M$ can not be $a=1$. But the equation avobe says that $a=y$ and we know that $x neq y$.
So $(x,y)-(y,x) notin S$, hence $x otimes y neq y otimes x$.
Is that correct? Anyone can give me any feed back?
Thank you.
proof-verification commutative-algebra modules tensor-products tensors
$endgroup$
add a comment |
$begingroup$
Consider $R=k[x,y]$, where $k$ is a field. Consider the $R$-module $M=langle x,yrangle$.
I would like to see that $x otimes y neq y otimes x$ in $M otimes_R M$.
My try to prove it:
Let $F$ be the free abelian group with basis $M times M$; that is, $F$ is free on all ordered pairs $(a,b)$ with $a,b in M$. Define $S$ to be the subgroup of $F$ generated by all elements of the following types:
- $(a,b+b')-(a,b)-(a,b')$
- $(a+a',b)-(a,b)-(a',b)$
- $(ar,b)-(a,rb)$
Since $M otimes_R M = F/S$, $x otimes y = y otimes x$ would imply that $(x,y)-(y,x)$ lies in $S$. This would imply that $(x,y)-(y,x)$ has one of the forms mentioned above.
Let's say
$$(x,y)-(y,x) = (ar,b)-(a,rb)$$ for some $a,b in M$ and some $r in R$.
Consider $M=langle x,y rangle = {cx+dy hspace{0,2cm}| c,d in k[x,y]}$.
The equality above would imply $ar=x$ and for that we would need $r=1$ and $a=x$ since $ain M$ can not be $a=1$. But the equation avobe says that $a=y$ and we know that $x neq y$.
So $(x,y)-(y,x) notin S$, hence $x otimes y neq y otimes x$.
Is that correct? Anyone can give me any feed back?
Thank you.
proof-verification commutative-algebra modules tensor-products tensors
$endgroup$
3
$begingroup$
$(x,y)-(y,x)in S$ does not mean it is of the form from 1,2 or 3. $S$ is the submodule generated by such elements.
$endgroup$
– Mohan
Nov 29 '18 at 16:23
$begingroup$
Totally true. Any help? Any hint?
$endgroup$
– idriskameni
Nov 29 '18 at 16:26
1
$begingroup$
Related: math.stackexchange.com/questions/542214/…
$endgroup$
– user26857
Dec 1 '18 at 10:20
add a comment |
$begingroup$
Consider $R=k[x,y]$, where $k$ is a field. Consider the $R$-module $M=langle x,yrangle$.
I would like to see that $x otimes y neq y otimes x$ in $M otimes_R M$.
My try to prove it:
Let $F$ be the free abelian group with basis $M times M$; that is, $F$ is free on all ordered pairs $(a,b)$ with $a,b in M$. Define $S$ to be the subgroup of $F$ generated by all elements of the following types:
- $(a,b+b')-(a,b)-(a,b')$
- $(a+a',b)-(a,b)-(a',b)$
- $(ar,b)-(a,rb)$
Since $M otimes_R M = F/S$, $x otimes y = y otimes x$ would imply that $(x,y)-(y,x)$ lies in $S$. This would imply that $(x,y)-(y,x)$ has one of the forms mentioned above.
Let's say
$$(x,y)-(y,x) = (ar,b)-(a,rb)$$ for some $a,b in M$ and some $r in R$.
Consider $M=langle x,y rangle = {cx+dy hspace{0,2cm}| c,d in k[x,y]}$.
The equality above would imply $ar=x$ and for that we would need $r=1$ and $a=x$ since $ain M$ can not be $a=1$. But the equation avobe says that $a=y$ and we know that $x neq y$.
So $(x,y)-(y,x) notin S$, hence $x otimes y neq y otimes x$.
Is that correct? Anyone can give me any feed back?
Thank you.
proof-verification commutative-algebra modules tensor-products tensors
$endgroup$
Consider $R=k[x,y]$, where $k$ is a field. Consider the $R$-module $M=langle x,yrangle$.
I would like to see that $x otimes y neq y otimes x$ in $M otimes_R M$.
My try to prove it:
Let $F$ be the free abelian group with basis $M times M$; that is, $F$ is free on all ordered pairs $(a,b)$ with $a,b in M$. Define $S$ to be the subgroup of $F$ generated by all elements of the following types:
- $(a,b+b')-(a,b)-(a,b')$
- $(a+a',b)-(a,b)-(a',b)$
- $(ar,b)-(a,rb)$
Since $M otimes_R M = F/S$, $x otimes y = y otimes x$ would imply that $(x,y)-(y,x)$ lies in $S$. This would imply that $(x,y)-(y,x)$ has one of the forms mentioned above.
Let's say
$$(x,y)-(y,x) = (ar,b)-(a,rb)$$ for some $a,b in M$ and some $r in R$.
Consider $M=langle x,y rangle = {cx+dy hspace{0,2cm}| c,d in k[x,y]}$.
The equality above would imply $ar=x$ and for that we would need $r=1$ and $a=x$ since $ain M$ can not be $a=1$. But the equation avobe says that $a=y$ and we know that $x neq y$.
So $(x,y)-(y,x) notin S$, hence $x otimes y neq y otimes x$.
Is that correct? Anyone can give me any feed back?
Thank you.
proof-verification commutative-algebra modules tensor-products tensors
proof-verification commutative-algebra modules tensor-products tensors
edited Dec 1 '18 at 10:20
user26857
39.3k124183
39.3k124183
asked Nov 29 '18 at 14:55
idriskameniidriskameni
18416
18416
3
$begingroup$
$(x,y)-(y,x)in S$ does not mean it is of the form from 1,2 or 3. $S$ is the submodule generated by such elements.
$endgroup$
– Mohan
Nov 29 '18 at 16:23
$begingroup$
Totally true. Any help? Any hint?
$endgroup$
– idriskameni
Nov 29 '18 at 16:26
1
$begingroup$
Related: math.stackexchange.com/questions/542214/…
$endgroup$
– user26857
Dec 1 '18 at 10:20
add a comment |
3
$begingroup$
$(x,y)-(y,x)in S$ does not mean it is of the form from 1,2 or 3. $S$ is the submodule generated by such elements.
$endgroup$
– Mohan
Nov 29 '18 at 16:23
$begingroup$
Totally true. Any help? Any hint?
$endgroup$
– idriskameni
Nov 29 '18 at 16:26
1
$begingroup$
Related: math.stackexchange.com/questions/542214/…
$endgroup$
– user26857
Dec 1 '18 at 10:20
3
3
$begingroup$
$(x,y)-(y,x)in S$ does not mean it is of the form from 1,2 or 3. $S$ is the submodule generated by such elements.
$endgroup$
– Mohan
Nov 29 '18 at 16:23
$begingroup$
$(x,y)-(y,x)in S$ does not mean it is of the form from 1,2 or 3. $S$ is the submodule generated by such elements.
$endgroup$
– Mohan
Nov 29 '18 at 16:23
$begingroup$
Totally true. Any help? Any hint?
$endgroup$
– idriskameni
Nov 29 '18 at 16:26
$begingroup$
Totally true. Any help? Any hint?
$endgroup$
– idriskameni
Nov 29 '18 at 16:26
1
1
$begingroup$
Related: math.stackexchange.com/questions/542214/…
$endgroup$
– user26857
Dec 1 '18 at 10:20
$begingroup$
Related: math.stackexchange.com/questions/542214/…
$endgroup$
– user26857
Dec 1 '18 at 10:20
add a comment |
1 Answer
1
active
oldest
votes
$begingroup$
From the Universal Property of the tensor product, we can develop a more concrete approach which amounts to constructing any $R$-bilinear map that witnesses the inequality of the simple tensors $x otimes y$ and $y otimes x$.
Let $a otimes b, c otimes d in M_1 otimes_R M_2$. The following our equivalent:
(1) $a otimes b = c otimes d$ in $M_1 otimes_R M_2$
(2) No $R$-bilinear map on $M_1 times M_2$ can distinguish $(a,b)$ from $(c,d)$.
(3) No $R$-linear map on $M_1 otimes M_2$ can distinguish $a otimes b$ from $c otimes d$.
Proof: (1) -> (2). Let $phi$ be an $R$-bilinear map. By the universal property, $phi$ factors as $tilde{phi}f$ where $f$ is the canonical balanced product $f(m,n) = m otimes n$. Thus $a otimes b = c otimes d implies f(a,b) = f(c,d) implies tilde{phi}{f}(a,b) = tilde{phi}{f}(c,d) implies phi(a,b) = phi(c,d)$.
(2) -> (1) Argue by contrapositive. If $a otimes b not= c otimes d = 0$ then the canonical balanced product is an $R$-bilinear map on $M_1 times M_2$ which distinguishes $(a,b)$ from $(c,d)$.
(3) -> (2) Let $phi$ be an $R$-bilinear map. Again, by the universal property, factor it as $tilde{phi}f = phi$. By assumption $tilde{phi}$ cannot distinguish between $a otimes b$ and $c otimes d$, so $phi(c,d) = tilde{phi}(aotimes b) = tilde{phi}(c otimes d) = phi(c,d)$.
(2) -> (3) Argue the contrapositive, noting that the composition of a bilinear map (in this case the canonical $R$-balanced product) and a linear map is again a bilinear map.
$square$
This turns the task of showing that two simple tensors are not equal into the task of fashioning a bilinear map which can distinguish them.
Thus, to show $x otimes y not= y otimes x$, our task is to construct a bilinear map $phi: M times M rightarrow N$ for any $R$-module $N$ such that $phi(x,y) not= phi(y,x)$.
I encourage you to work through it from here, because this sort of construction turns up often, but I'll leave a hint in the spoiler below.
How about setting $phi(ax + by, cx + dy) = ad - bc$?
$endgroup$
$begingroup$
Thank you very much. From what you said, the only thing you leave me with is cheking the bilinear thing I guess. But my question comes from: How do you see from Universal Property the if and only if? I mean, I know: For any $R$-module $N$ and any multilinear-map $ F: M times M longrightarrow N$, there exists a unique module homomorphism $f: M otimes_R M longrightarrow N$ such that $f circ t = F$. How do you see the "if and only if"?
$endgroup$
– idriskameni
Nov 29 '18 at 18:10
1
$begingroup$
Edited, hope this is helpful.
$endgroup$
– Badam Baplan
Nov 29 '18 at 19:29
$begingroup$
A bilinear form is a function that ends in a field. But here R is not a field, is it? I mean, is $phi$ a R-bilinear form? $phi: M times M longrightarrow k[x,y] (field)$?
$endgroup$
– idriskameni
Dec 4 '18 at 15:11
$begingroup$
very sorry about that, i was incorrectly writing 'form' when i just meant 'map.' corrected now. Note that the hint in the spoiler is just a hint at how to define the map, and not a fully defined map in itself, since elements of $(x,y)$ generally have higher order terms.
$endgroup$
– Badam Baplan
Dec 5 '18 at 1:30
add a comment |
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$begingroup$
From the Universal Property of the tensor product, we can develop a more concrete approach which amounts to constructing any $R$-bilinear map that witnesses the inequality of the simple tensors $x otimes y$ and $y otimes x$.
Let $a otimes b, c otimes d in M_1 otimes_R M_2$. The following our equivalent:
(1) $a otimes b = c otimes d$ in $M_1 otimes_R M_2$
(2) No $R$-bilinear map on $M_1 times M_2$ can distinguish $(a,b)$ from $(c,d)$.
(3) No $R$-linear map on $M_1 otimes M_2$ can distinguish $a otimes b$ from $c otimes d$.
Proof: (1) -> (2). Let $phi$ be an $R$-bilinear map. By the universal property, $phi$ factors as $tilde{phi}f$ where $f$ is the canonical balanced product $f(m,n) = m otimes n$. Thus $a otimes b = c otimes d implies f(a,b) = f(c,d) implies tilde{phi}{f}(a,b) = tilde{phi}{f}(c,d) implies phi(a,b) = phi(c,d)$.
(2) -> (1) Argue by contrapositive. If $a otimes b not= c otimes d = 0$ then the canonical balanced product is an $R$-bilinear map on $M_1 times M_2$ which distinguishes $(a,b)$ from $(c,d)$.
(3) -> (2) Let $phi$ be an $R$-bilinear map. Again, by the universal property, factor it as $tilde{phi}f = phi$. By assumption $tilde{phi}$ cannot distinguish between $a otimes b$ and $c otimes d$, so $phi(c,d) = tilde{phi}(aotimes b) = tilde{phi}(c otimes d) = phi(c,d)$.
(2) -> (3) Argue the contrapositive, noting that the composition of a bilinear map (in this case the canonical $R$-balanced product) and a linear map is again a bilinear map.
$square$
This turns the task of showing that two simple tensors are not equal into the task of fashioning a bilinear map which can distinguish them.
Thus, to show $x otimes y not= y otimes x$, our task is to construct a bilinear map $phi: M times M rightarrow N$ for any $R$-module $N$ such that $phi(x,y) not= phi(y,x)$.
I encourage you to work through it from here, because this sort of construction turns up often, but I'll leave a hint in the spoiler below.
How about setting $phi(ax + by, cx + dy) = ad - bc$?
$endgroup$
$begingroup$
Thank you very much. From what you said, the only thing you leave me with is cheking the bilinear thing I guess. But my question comes from: How do you see from Universal Property the if and only if? I mean, I know: For any $R$-module $N$ and any multilinear-map $ F: M times M longrightarrow N$, there exists a unique module homomorphism $f: M otimes_R M longrightarrow N$ such that $f circ t = F$. How do you see the "if and only if"?
$endgroup$
– idriskameni
Nov 29 '18 at 18:10
1
$begingroup$
Edited, hope this is helpful.
$endgroup$
– Badam Baplan
Nov 29 '18 at 19:29
$begingroup$
A bilinear form is a function that ends in a field. But here R is not a field, is it? I mean, is $phi$ a R-bilinear form? $phi: M times M longrightarrow k[x,y] (field)$?
$endgroup$
– idriskameni
Dec 4 '18 at 15:11
$begingroup$
very sorry about that, i was incorrectly writing 'form' when i just meant 'map.' corrected now. Note that the hint in the spoiler is just a hint at how to define the map, and not a fully defined map in itself, since elements of $(x,y)$ generally have higher order terms.
$endgroup$
– Badam Baplan
Dec 5 '18 at 1:30
add a comment |
$begingroup$
From the Universal Property of the tensor product, we can develop a more concrete approach which amounts to constructing any $R$-bilinear map that witnesses the inequality of the simple tensors $x otimes y$ and $y otimes x$.
Let $a otimes b, c otimes d in M_1 otimes_R M_2$. The following our equivalent:
(1) $a otimes b = c otimes d$ in $M_1 otimes_R M_2$
(2) No $R$-bilinear map on $M_1 times M_2$ can distinguish $(a,b)$ from $(c,d)$.
(3) No $R$-linear map on $M_1 otimes M_2$ can distinguish $a otimes b$ from $c otimes d$.
Proof: (1) -> (2). Let $phi$ be an $R$-bilinear map. By the universal property, $phi$ factors as $tilde{phi}f$ where $f$ is the canonical balanced product $f(m,n) = m otimes n$. Thus $a otimes b = c otimes d implies f(a,b) = f(c,d) implies tilde{phi}{f}(a,b) = tilde{phi}{f}(c,d) implies phi(a,b) = phi(c,d)$.
(2) -> (1) Argue by contrapositive. If $a otimes b not= c otimes d = 0$ then the canonical balanced product is an $R$-bilinear map on $M_1 times M_2$ which distinguishes $(a,b)$ from $(c,d)$.
(3) -> (2) Let $phi$ be an $R$-bilinear map. Again, by the universal property, factor it as $tilde{phi}f = phi$. By assumption $tilde{phi}$ cannot distinguish between $a otimes b$ and $c otimes d$, so $phi(c,d) = tilde{phi}(aotimes b) = tilde{phi}(c otimes d) = phi(c,d)$.
(2) -> (3) Argue the contrapositive, noting that the composition of a bilinear map (in this case the canonical $R$-balanced product) and a linear map is again a bilinear map.
$square$
This turns the task of showing that two simple tensors are not equal into the task of fashioning a bilinear map which can distinguish them.
Thus, to show $x otimes y not= y otimes x$, our task is to construct a bilinear map $phi: M times M rightarrow N$ for any $R$-module $N$ such that $phi(x,y) not= phi(y,x)$.
I encourage you to work through it from here, because this sort of construction turns up often, but I'll leave a hint in the spoiler below.
How about setting $phi(ax + by, cx + dy) = ad - bc$?
$endgroup$
$begingroup$
Thank you very much. From what you said, the only thing you leave me with is cheking the bilinear thing I guess. But my question comes from: How do you see from Universal Property the if and only if? I mean, I know: For any $R$-module $N$ and any multilinear-map $ F: M times M longrightarrow N$, there exists a unique module homomorphism $f: M otimes_R M longrightarrow N$ such that $f circ t = F$. How do you see the "if and only if"?
$endgroup$
– idriskameni
Nov 29 '18 at 18:10
1
$begingroup$
Edited, hope this is helpful.
$endgroup$
– Badam Baplan
Nov 29 '18 at 19:29
$begingroup$
A bilinear form is a function that ends in a field. But here R is not a field, is it? I mean, is $phi$ a R-bilinear form? $phi: M times M longrightarrow k[x,y] (field)$?
$endgroup$
– idriskameni
Dec 4 '18 at 15:11
$begingroup$
very sorry about that, i was incorrectly writing 'form' when i just meant 'map.' corrected now. Note that the hint in the spoiler is just a hint at how to define the map, and not a fully defined map in itself, since elements of $(x,y)$ generally have higher order terms.
$endgroup$
– Badam Baplan
Dec 5 '18 at 1:30
add a comment |
$begingroup$
From the Universal Property of the tensor product, we can develop a more concrete approach which amounts to constructing any $R$-bilinear map that witnesses the inequality of the simple tensors $x otimes y$ and $y otimes x$.
Let $a otimes b, c otimes d in M_1 otimes_R M_2$. The following our equivalent:
(1) $a otimes b = c otimes d$ in $M_1 otimes_R M_2$
(2) No $R$-bilinear map on $M_1 times M_2$ can distinguish $(a,b)$ from $(c,d)$.
(3) No $R$-linear map on $M_1 otimes M_2$ can distinguish $a otimes b$ from $c otimes d$.
Proof: (1) -> (2). Let $phi$ be an $R$-bilinear map. By the universal property, $phi$ factors as $tilde{phi}f$ where $f$ is the canonical balanced product $f(m,n) = m otimes n$. Thus $a otimes b = c otimes d implies f(a,b) = f(c,d) implies tilde{phi}{f}(a,b) = tilde{phi}{f}(c,d) implies phi(a,b) = phi(c,d)$.
(2) -> (1) Argue by contrapositive. If $a otimes b not= c otimes d = 0$ then the canonical balanced product is an $R$-bilinear map on $M_1 times M_2$ which distinguishes $(a,b)$ from $(c,d)$.
(3) -> (2) Let $phi$ be an $R$-bilinear map. Again, by the universal property, factor it as $tilde{phi}f = phi$. By assumption $tilde{phi}$ cannot distinguish between $a otimes b$ and $c otimes d$, so $phi(c,d) = tilde{phi}(aotimes b) = tilde{phi}(c otimes d) = phi(c,d)$.
(2) -> (3) Argue the contrapositive, noting that the composition of a bilinear map (in this case the canonical $R$-balanced product) and a linear map is again a bilinear map.
$square$
This turns the task of showing that two simple tensors are not equal into the task of fashioning a bilinear map which can distinguish them.
Thus, to show $x otimes y not= y otimes x$, our task is to construct a bilinear map $phi: M times M rightarrow N$ for any $R$-module $N$ such that $phi(x,y) not= phi(y,x)$.
I encourage you to work through it from here, because this sort of construction turns up often, but I'll leave a hint in the spoiler below.
How about setting $phi(ax + by, cx + dy) = ad - bc$?
$endgroup$
From the Universal Property of the tensor product, we can develop a more concrete approach which amounts to constructing any $R$-bilinear map that witnesses the inequality of the simple tensors $x otimes y$ and $y otimes x$.
Let $a otimes b, c otimes d in M_1 otimes_R M_2$. The following our equivalent:
(1) $a otimes b = c otimes d$ in $M_1 otimes_R M_2$
(2) No $R$-bilinear map on $M_1 times M_2$ can distinguish $(a,b)$ from $(c,d)$.
(3) No $R$-linear map on $M_1 otimes M_2$ can distinguish $a otimes b$ from $c otimes d$.
Proof: (1) -> (2). Let $phi$ be an $R$-bilinear map. By the universal property, $phi$ factors as $tilde{phi}f$ where $f$ is the canonical balanced product $f(m,n) = m otimes n$. Thus $a otimes b = c otimes d implies f(a,b) = f(c,d) implies tilde{phi}{f}(a,b) = tilde{phi}{f}(c,d) implies phi(a,b) = phi(c,d)$.
(2) -> (1) Argue by contrapositive. If $a otimes b not= c otimes d = 0$ then the canonical balanced product is an $R$-bilinear map on $M_1 times M_2$ which distinguishes $(a,b)$ from $(c,d)$.
(3) -> (2) Let $phi$ be an $R$-bilinear map. Again, by the universal property, factor it as $tilde{phi}f = phi$. By assumption $tilde{phi}$ cannot distinguish between $a otimes b$ and $c otimes d$, so $phi(c,d) = tilde{phi}(aotimes b) = tilde{phi}(c otimes d) = phi(c,d)$.
(2) -> (3) Argue the contrapositive, noting that the composition of a bilinear map (in this case the canonical $R$-balanced product) and a linear map is again a bilinear map.
$square$
This turns the task of showing that two simple tensors are not equal into the task of fashioning a bilinear map which can distinguish them.
Thus, to show $x otimes y not= y otimes x$, our task is to construct a bilinear map $phi: M times M rightarrow N$ for any $R$-module $N$ such that $phi(x,y) not= phi(y,x)$.
I encourage you to work through it from here, because this sort of construction turns up often, but I'll leave a hint in the spoiler below.
How about setting $phi(ax + by, cx + dy) = ad - bc$?
edited Dec 5 '18 at 1:24
answered Nov 29 '18 at 17:39
Badam BaplanBadam Baplan
4,476722
4,476722
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Thank you very much. From what you said, the only thing you leave me with is cheking the bilinear thing I guess. But my question comes from: How do you see from Universal Property the if and only if? I mean, I know: For any $R$-module $N$ and any multilinear-map $ F: M times M longrightarrow N$, there exists a unique module homomorphism $f: M otimes_R M longrightarrow N$ such that $f circ t = F$. How do you see the "if and only if"?
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– idriskameni
Nov 29 '18 at 18:10
1
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Edited, hope this is helpful.
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– Badam Baplan
Nov 29 '18 at 19:29
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A bilinear form is a function that ends in a field. But here R is not a field, is it? I mean, is $phi$ a R-bilinear form? $phi: M times M longrightarrow k[x,y] (field)$?
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– idriskameni
Dec 4 '18 at 15:11
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very sorry about that, i was incorrectly writing 'form' when i just meant 'map.' corrected now. Note that the hint in the spoiler is just a hint at how to define the map, and not a fully defined map in itself, since elements of $(x,y)$ generally have higher order terms.
$endgroup$
– Badam Baplan
Dec 5 '18 at 1:30
add a comment |
$begingroup$
Thank you very much. From what you said, the only thing you leave me with is cheking the bilinear thing I guess. But my question comes from: How do you see from Universal Property the if and only if? I mean, I know: For any $R$-module $N$ and any multilinear-map $ F: M times M longrightarrow N$, there exists a unique module homomorphism $f: M otimes_R M longrightarrow N$ such that $f circ t = F$. How do you see the "if and only if"?
$endgroup$
– idriskameni
Nov 29 '18 at 18:10
1
$begingroup$
Edited, hope this is helpful.
$endgroup$
– Badam Baplan
Nov 29 '18 at 19:29
$begingroup$
A bilinear form is a function that ends in a field. But here R is not a field, is it? I mean, is $phi$ a R-bilinear form? $phi: M times M longrightarrow k[x,y] (field)$?
$endgroup$
– idriskameni
Dec 4 '18 at 15:11
$begingroup$
very sorry about that, i was incorrectly writing 'form' when i just meant 'map.' corrected now. Note that the hint in the spoiler is just a hint at how to define the map, and not a fully defined map in itself, since elements of $(x,y)$ generally have higher order terms.
$endgroup$
– Badam Baplan
Dec 5 '18 at 1:30
$begingroup$
Thank you very much. From what you said, the only thing you leave me with is cheking the bilinear thing I guess. But my question comes from: How do you see from Universal Property the if and only if? I mean, I know: For any $R$-module $N$ and any multilinear-map $ F: M times M longrightarrow N$, there exists a unique module homomorphism $f: M otimes_R M longrightarrow N$ such that $f circ t = F$. How do you see the "if and only if"?
$endgroup$
– idriskameni
Nov 29 '18 at 18:10
$begingroup$
Thank you very much. From what you said, the only thing you leave me with is cheking the bilinear thing I guess. But my question comes from: How do you see from Universal Property the if and only if? I mean, I know: For any $R$-module $N$ and any multilinear-map $ F: M times M longrightarrow N$, there exists a unique module homomorphism $f: M otimes_R M longrightarrow N$ such that $f circ t = F$. How do you see the "if and only if"?
$endgroup$
– idriskameni
Nov 29 '18 at 18:10
1
1
$begingroup$
Edited, hope this is helpful.
$endgroup$
– Badam Baplan
Nov 29 '18 at 19:29
$begingroup$
Edited, hope this is helpful.
$endgroup$
– Badam Baplan
Nov 29 '18 at 19:29
$begingroup$
A bilinear form is a function that ends in a field. But here R is not a field, is it? I mean, is $phi$ a R-bilinear form? $phi: M times M longrightarrow k[x,y] (field)$?
$endgroup$
– idriskameni
Dec 4 '18 at 15:11
$begingroup$
A bilinear form is a function that ends in a field. But here R is not a field, is it? I mean, is $phi$ a R-bilinear form? $phi: M times M longrightarrow k[x,y] (field)$?
$endgroup$
– idriskameni
Dec 4 '18 at 15:11
$begingroup$
very sorry about that, i was incorrectly writing 'form' when i just meant 'map.' corrected now. Note that the hint in the spoiler is just a hint at how to define the map, and not a fully defined map in itself, since elements of $(x,y)$ generally have higher order terms.
$endgroup$
– Badam Baplan
Dec 5 '18 at 1:30
$begingroup$
very sorry about that, i was incorrectly writing 'form' when i just meant 'map.' corrected now. Note that the hint in the spoiler is just a hint at how to define the map, and not a fully defined map in itself, since elements of $(x,y)$ generally have higher order terms.
$endgroup$
– Badam Baplan
Dec 5 '18 at 1:30
add a comment |
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$(x,y)-(y,x)in S$ does not mean it is of the form from 1,2 or 3. $S$ is the submodule generated by such elements.
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– Mohan
Nov 29 '18 at 16:23
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Totally true. Any help? Any hint?
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– idriskameni
Nov 29 '18 at 16:26
1
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Related: math.stackexchange.com/questions/542214/…
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– user26857
Dec 1 '18 at 10:20